In this episode, I interviewed Vicki Birch, the Canals and River Trust’s Participation, Health & Wellbeing Project Manager (North West). Vicki came to volunteer for the day at our project, Burscough Community Farm. She told me the story of how getting involved with water sports changed her life, her family’s lives and even her career.

This is a pilot episode and there are many more to come.

[Music]

Intro – Neil

Hello, I’m Neil Hickson and this is We All Need Nature, the podcast about green social prescribing. [Music

In this episode I’m joined by Vicki Birch of the Canals and River Trust. She takes me into the world of blue social prescribing, that is getting people into, onto or alongside water to improve their well-being. [Music]Vicki came to our project,Burscough Community Farm, to volunteer for a day

Vicki works for the Canals and River Trust and the Trust give her two days every year that she can use to volunteer with other organisations. I’d metVicki at a recent Natural England event where she’d told me about her very interesting job. I work for Canals and River Trust as the participation, health and well-being project manager

Vicki

I support our project coordinators to deliver participatory campaigns. It could be planting, it could be yoga, it could be knitting.

Neil

We’ll come back to the knitting later.

Vicki also tells me her story of how wanting to find her own thing in life opened up huge changes to her, her family and eventually her career.

Vicki

I saw a sign for a canoe club, I was terrified. I had never done anything like that before.

[Music]

Neil

Our farm is sandwiched between two strips of water. On one side is a small river called the Ellerbrook. It sometimes swells to scary levels, three metres above the field. And on the other side is the Rufford branch of the Leeds to Liverpool Canal.

Over the years both of them have made successful attempts at getting into the farm and putting us under water. The threat of flooding often makes me feel our neighbouring canal is a malevolent beast and we need to be wary of it. The canal’s surface is four or five feet above the level of the field, and it’s weird to see barges sail by at head height.

But Vicki gave me a new perspective on the canal and how we could make use of our watery neighbour to extend what the farm can offer people. At the end of the volunteer day, Vicki agreed to sit down with me and have a chat for the podcast.

Vicki

I cover the whole of the North West and I support our project coordinators to deliver participatory campaigns. So we call it Let’s, Let’s Walk, Let’s Paddle, Let’s Cycle. It could be planting, it could be yoga, it could be knitting, it’s anything that gets people active, socialising and then connecting with their waterways.

Neil

I never connected knitting with waterways, how does that work? Vicki

Vicki

So knitting is generally for older residents and the local community and they will come together to socialise and they will do arts and crafts generally to feed into our events. So they made big paper mache hats, so it’s not always knitting, it’s a bit of craft. They’ve made mosaics. They are currently covering one of our old logo gazebos with lovely patterns, because gazebos cost an absolute fortune, and yeah they’re covering it up and making it usable for many more days.

Neil

So you’ve really been sort of creative there finding new ways that people can link to the canal system which you know that’s the kind of industrial transport system from just 200 years ago and there’s like a relevance to it now.

Vicki

Yeah definitely my role is very much about connecting people to heritage, ecology and then people. So how do people use space and how can that so the canals as you say 200 years old, how do they have meaning for people today? So it’s very important that we talk about the heritage and why and how the canals were built and why they’re here but how they use today as well and it’s very different from their original use. Yeah massive network isn’t over the whole country.

[Birds chirping]

It was about 10 years ago we were going through a diagnosis for my son for autism and at the time he was presenting with very challenging behaviour and you very quickly become quite isolated so I knew I needed to get out and do something. I saw a sign for a canoe club, I was terrified. I had never done anything like that before. I was working in schools at the time and went down really loved it and over the space of a year the instructors supported me and I became an instructor and because I was working in a school I started to take other young people out because I’d seen my son flourish on the water because the family joined me they heard about how much fun I was having. They came along loved it so I thought right there’s a lot of children in school who really struggle academically maybe getting themselves in trouble to get them out on the water just see and they loved it and they thrived and the ones who were probably getting in trouble at school were the ones who were the leaders on the water and they just found their place and they loved it so I saw a job at Canal River Trust for the Desmond Family Canoe Trail so it was a project working with 16 to 24 year olds getting young people out doing social action, vegetation management, litter picks, art projects. I just thought this job’s written for me. So with a lot of encouragement from my mum I applied for the job and I’ve now been at the Trust for six years and I’ve worked my way up to the role I’m in now where I support our project coordinators to help shape their offer.

Neil

So that really was a transformation story for your family as well as your son?

Vicki

Yeah definitely so being struggling academically he was just constantly in trouble all the time and getting phone calls home and then we got into the paddling and I was telling everybody how much fun I was having then the kids came along and he just thrived he found this environment where he could paddle as hard as he wanted and he could jump in the water and really just be him so we flourished. Then we met a lot of people with similar interests and you go away camping at the weekend and then you’re traveling to the French Alps and just it did it transformed our lives so that just shows just trying something new you never know where that might take you.

Neil

Yeah so it’s taken you not only helped you and helped your family helped you your son there it’s actually turned into a career really linking you to water.

Vicki

Yeah so I through my son I ended up going on a journey of I need to know give me the information so I started studying social psychology and then I finished that so I was then I decided right what do I do now so then I decided to try health psychology so I did a master’s in health psychology and just really now figuring out what that bridge is between the clinical model and what it is that we do with the green and blue getting people out and active and how we can all learn to speak the same language and we know that there are certain audiences that might not go for support in a clinical setting but they might come along with us and have a walk and on that walk they might meet somebody and socialise and really begin to open up and it’s a bit like going on a journey so throughout that walk along the canal will only have been there an hour but by the end of it people have formed new friendships and those social opportunities and really taking the time taking the time just to connect with nature and we might stop along the way and talk a little bit about the heritage or the wildlife that changes and every corner that you turn on so yeah there’s definitely something very therapeutic about being on the waterways.

Neil

People love water don’t they? They’re drawn to it I don’t know it’s a natural instinct from our ancestors were we obviously need water to drink but also water is a place where animals go to feed you go down to the beach the seaside and there’s there’s food lying around literally isn’t there so I think there’s this draw towards water. Something you mentioned there I was quite interested in what’s the journey for people getting into what you provide how do you recruit people how do they get involved?

Vicki

So it’s very much place-based and it depends on what the project is. People can be socially prescribed onto our offer they can also come through another community partner so like yourselves we might connect with you and you offer an amazing space and growing and nature and then you might decide to join with us to go on a walk or get people in a boat for a change and we offer something that adds to your offer and through that way you are the gatekeeper so that community gets to know us they learn a little bit more about the waterways and also people use the toll paths for walking to work cycling to work taking the grandchildren out to feed the ducks we’ve all been there it’s part of growing up isn’t it and just connecting with that water space so the more that we talk to people and just raise awareness of what it is that we offer and how they can get involved and making sure that if there isn’t an offer there for somebody that they’re interested in then that’s where we look to shape it with those people.

Neil

Quite a unique job then isn’t it and presumably this works to the canal’s advantage in that that you’re seeing your asset the canal and the rivers being used more creatively.

Vicki

Yeah definitely so our vision is about transforming places and enriching lives and the canals run through very diverse communities and each community might use it differently so it’s very important that we understand and get to know that community and then empower them through training through access to resources through connecting so we might meet yourself it was a fantastic project and we know that there are other projects out there that may benefit from you or even just come in having a talk to you we make those connections as well so it’s about if we stepped away is that community stronger from the work that we’ve done that’s the shift that we’re working towards now.

Neil

How would an organisation a project like ours get to work with you what’s that process?

Vicki

So for yourself you’re in a prime location you’re right next to the canal it’s really about embracing the waterways and bringing that into your community office we talked about gatekeepers before you are a gatekeeper for this community you are a trusted partner so people might walk down the canal to arrive at your space so it’s just taking a moment to reflect about that journey and capturing it as well because the more we recognise and understand people are using the waterways then tow paths will be repaired. Investment is brought into the area but it’s about listening to the local people as well and what is it that they want and need so it’s about being open and being approachable so and making sure our offer is advertised on our website and every October we have a let’s collaborate community forum that’s when we do our business planning so it’s where we’re thinking about right okay how are we going to work in our community engagement for the year ahead and then we put an open call out to anybody in the northwest come and have a chat with us tell us about your projects how can we work together collaboratively can we apply for joint funding together what does that look like in the bigger picture in the bigger context for Lancashire or Merseyside how can we make all of that connect together.

Neil

It’s a dimension to what the canals do that I didn’t appreciate or know about and it sounds like something that we could maybe explore further other projects unlike ours that you can give me an example of that has worked with you?

Vicki

Yeah so we have a project called Northern Lily in Oldham very much like yourself. They’ve adopted a parcel of land I think it’s from the local authority they’ve grown it it’s amazing they have a little bit of an orchard they really well engage with the community and we had some funding from Sport England that we were distributing in response to the pandemic small grants five to ten thousand pound and it was to engage communities in physical activity working with the Sport England target audiences. So they contacted us, we came down, we had a chat with them we gave them some introductory paddle sessions, they loved it. They were right on the canal and they just really wanted to embrace the waterways, so through that funding they were able to buy some paddle sports equipment and go through training for their community leaders for their project leaders and they now go out and they do paddling and they do litter picks and they do vegetation management and they’re really connecting with that whole space around their project

Neil

For us, thinking the canal is a separate thing from us. We’re right next to it. It’s there, but I don’t think we’ve really engaged with it and seen it as an asset to part of our land so so what you’re saying is what we could do is incorporate it into activities on the farm yeah definitely.

Vicki

So, if you are looking to extend your reach we talked before about social prescribers so just examples ideas that run around in my head. I call them fireworks they go off.

Neill

Go for it, set a few off for me.

Vicki

So, sometimes transport can be a barrier, so if you know you’re trying to reach an audience and the canal is a route then we could work together to create maybe maps that would signpost how to get to the farm down the map from from a bit like the the brown sign thing that you see on um on the sides of the roads for places yeah but we could bring that to life so in other areas for example we’ve had the community involved and we’ve written poems and then throughout the canal we might have posts along the canal with sections of the poem on so that will really bring to life that route and make it part of the journey. The other side of it then could be because you’re a growing project it may be that you would have to communicate with our ecologists but if you wanted to extend what you do out onto the canal network and you could plant trees or berries or strawberries and things like that along the route as well so it’s kind of that journey to the farm along the canal so yes a project like that you would have to make sure that you communicate with canal and river choice and get permission, but our ecologists are definitely open to that kind of collaborative working

Neil

That’s really interesting there’s quite a few things that we could perhaps see the canal not as just a body of water that’s higher than our land, and sometimes we feel it even is a threat to us but as something as an asset that we can utilise, certainly for walks and for things like that now finding it more and more that this idea of green social prescribing the ability for it to transform people. Is that your experience from what you’ve seen?

Vicki

Obviously your experience it yourself but from seeing other people go through it yeah definitely people when they come to us to try volunteering they might try one thing but through speaking to other people they’ll weave their way through the trust many people then have gone on to work and employment. We have a walking project in Cheshire it was targeting over 55s who were inactive, socially isolated, or maybe physically inactive, so not very active and it was a 12-week program they came out they might do just a 10-minute walk at the beginning on the first week and then we work up to an hour. At the end at the 12 weeks and they loved it and the idea is after that you’ve made some friends and maybe you’ll feel a bit more confident and that you’ll go off. But they loved it and they wanted to stay, so we’ve got 20 volunteers that lead on our walking program in Cheshire and I would say about 75 percent of them have actually been through the program themselves so they’ve loved it they’ve really enjoyed and wanted to give back so they’ve stayed with us.

Neil

So, they’ve become almost evangelists.

Vicki

Yeah they’re just inspiring the next group of participants that are coming through and we’ve had to create a social walk so there’s now a 12-week program and a social walk because people love it the walks are never more than an hour leisurely walks a lot of history heritage a lot of ecology nature and then there’s always a brew at the end and cake hopefully

Neil

Always cake, must always be cake. So one thing that we’re thinking of introducing here at the farm is structured courses . We’re sort of free and open and people can come and they can go whenever they want on volunteer days, but I’m wondering whether if we offered them a course with it we feel a little bit more compelled to come back and try again and again a few times. What’s your experience of organising courses and things?

Vicki

So there’s a bit of a mixture feedback that we get is to sign up with mostly 12-week programmes. It’s a bit intimidating if you’ve never been before to say oh yeah I’ll commit to x amount of time so we’ve talked about maybe having a one-off taster session and then sign up to the program after, so we’ve talked a lot to Job Centres and they’ve talked about people that they’re trying to encourage into work but they know they’re not ready there’s a lot more that they need to do so it might just be building confidence building motivation just building that routine again of stepping back out and to just jump back into employment is a big step so having a structured course where they can come along and just really get back into that routine of being around people sometimes and having to be out at a certain time learning again it’s all part of getting back into work so there’s definitely a demand out there for it.

Neil

You mentioned they’re about having a taste today what sort of onboarding process would you use to take people on and make sure that they know what they’re doing?

Vicki

We’ve got a new volunteering structure, so historically the trust volunteer offer was very much gardening, laying tall paths, cutting back vegetation well that might not be for everybody and we’ve got an events team we’ve got a community engagement team we’ve got an operations team we’ve got engineering so there’s a whole diverse offer out there for them so we’ll have a taste today where they’ll come and they’ll just learn about the trust to maybe talk to some of the staff from the different teams have a brew, biscuits on the cake

Neil

Always cake

Vicki

And just really get to know us and through that time just understanding what people’s interests are and then trying to map them into that offer and i suppose that’s very much like you’ve got amazing space here and there’s so many different activities for people to do that just making sure that each activity is reflected oh something else that we’ve done as well is day in the life of a lock keeper a day in the life of an explorer so that’s the children and young people so interviewing some of the volunteers and saying what do you do on a daily basis and really just helping people to imagine what it would be like to to be in that role for the day and so what do you do with that then do you is that putting a video content or do they actually talk to the person direct yeah it should be advertised on our website under the volunteering section there should be case study videos there that’ll just give you an example so on the Cheshire walking program there are videos of our volunteers and the participants that are talking about their journey and how they were a bit worried before they started but surprised that by week 12 they were able to walk confidently for that hour so it’s really just giving you that person’s perspective of that volunteer or that participant of what their journey has been.

Neil

So, that’s something that perhaps we could do maybe on a smaller scale, but and do you think the the 12 weeks is that like an optimal time?

Vicki

So the 12 weeks for us is a key number for behaviour change so like your gym will give you a three-month membership, so a 12-week program for us is if you do something consistently for 12 weeks at the same time on the same day you’re more likely to continue that long term but some people might be put off by such a long time.

Neil

It sounds a long time doesn’t it? So what would you recommend for us? We’ve got this length of canal running adjacent to our field. What kind of canoeing you mentioned there’s stand-up paddle boarding or are you always thought something like Indian canoe just sort of slowly going through and seeing the wildlife etc. What would you recommend for us here on this site?

Vicki

Yeah, so it depends what you want to do on the water, but I would always say speak to your participants, and like me if they’ve never done it before they might not know it’s for them so we could do some taster sessions for you, bring down a range of craft, but really understanding how it would enhance your offer. So, if you wanted to just go for a paddle and do a water vole survey for example, any craft. So the canoes are great, you can chuck your packed lunch in there, you can chuck your safety bagging and picnic blanket.

Neil

And what type of canoe, Canadian canoe?

Vicki

So about 16 foot canoe you can go for a leisurely paddle on them, but I love the stand-up paddle boards. It’s just the freedom. You can stand up, you can sit down, you do yoga on them

Neil

Sounds a bit precarious I gotta say.

Vicki

No a lot it’s seated and lying down yoga, modified poses, your downward dog is really he doesn’t matter how many times you do it but when you go onto downward dog and the sky’s up and the water’s down it yeah it’s magical about that.

Neil

It sounds precarious, but anyway, a couple of Canadian type canoes which we could carry down from the barn here, take them to the water and a sunny afternoon just gently paddle along looking at the ducks and the coots and the moorhens and water voles maybe? I don’t know.

Vicki

Yeah take a packed lunch with you. A lot of the time we raft the canoes, so all that means is we put two canoes together and we put a wooden beam in the middle.

Neil

That’s more stable I presume.

Vicki

Yeah, exactly so. I would say in a single canoe you could probably get two adults and a child but if you raft them together you could get six to eight people in a raft, and then it’s really stable. It doesn’t matter how good you are at paddling and you can just really enjoy being out on the water then.

Neil

That sounds ideal this is another dimension something else that we could add to our offer here at Burscough Community Farm. That’s brilliant, thank you very much.

Outro – Neil

Are you a social prescriber or perhaps you’ve benefited from being socially prescribed something?

Or maybe you just like to get outside and feel so much better because of that.

If you’ve got a story you’d like to share with us, please get in touch. Contact me through our website: weallneednature.com.

Thank you